On Killing: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society
Selected Book Details
- Paperback
- Edition: Revised
- Author: Dave Grossman
- Publisher: Back Bay Books
- Release Date: June 2009
- ISBN-10: 0316040932
- ISBN-13: 9780316040938
- List Price: $15.99
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Summaries and Customer Reviews provided by Amazon
SummaryThe good news is that most soldiers are loath to kill. But armies have developed sophisticated ways of overcoming this instinctive aversion. And contemporary civilian society, particularly the media, replicates the army's conditioning techniques, and, according to Lt. Col. Dave Grossman's thesis, is responsible for our rising rate of murder among the young. |
Customer Reviews
Average Rating: 
Must Read for warriors and peace officers
Rating:
If you have spent time, or plan on spending time, in situations that require the use of deadly force, you MUST read this book to mentally prepare yourself.
Should be Required Reading for Many
Rating:
This book is a brillantly composed collection of information, studies and insights regarding the impacts of our training, emotions and after effects in regards to killing another human being. It should be required for every psychologist and physichiatrist specially those working with Viet Nam veterans and PTSD.
For the veterans of war themselves, understand why you did what you did and understand how you were manipulated to that point. It is a healing tool beyond any others I have seen. I highly recommend it to all combat veterans regardless of theater.
the psychology of justi
Rating:
This work is the most insightful I have encountered since Konrad Lorenz's book, "On Aggression" which I read in the early 1960's. Man's reluctance to indulge in face-to-face homicide must be viewed as a Darwinian response shared with other species, even reptiles. It leads me to wonder, why did it take so long to articulate this basic element of our nature? It was quite illuminating. It was required reading for my son who is being deployed to Iraq this week as an Army major to a part of the world where humiliation of one's enemies is the cultural norm, and killing is "colllateral damage", as in 9/11.
Baloney
Rating: 
I bought it, I read some of it, and I put it aside. I won't give the book one star because Grossman IS an engaging writer and the material IS interesting. Interesting, yes, but Grossman's interpretation is massively flawed. He has once again reminded me that NO ONE who has not been in combat can understand what it's like.
First let's explore Grossman's view that American soldiers can't shoot straight because they don't want to kill the other side: South Vietnam, June 1970. My very first shoot-out in Vietnam. I am an 18-year old Army private, newly arrived in-country. I am excited to be there... lots of new sounds and sights... and smells. I am sitting up on the bunker line of a fire base, talking quietly with another, more experienced soldier, when a trip flare out in the wire goes off and about a hundred voices shout, "Gooks in the wire! Everybody on the line!!!"
It is the defining moment in the life of very American G.I. who ever saw a war. And it was all over in about 10 minutes. Well,the sappers made a quick retreat, we fired up the night, they fired back...no one was hurt. But when the thing was over and I had managed to pop a Lucky into my lip, a Lucky that my new friend had to light for me because I was shaking too hard to hit the end of my target, my new bud, just as calm as you please, asked me (actually shouted, we were both deaf from the gun fire) this: "Vidaurri, did you happen to notice all the tracers in the air?"
"Yeah... so what?"
Well, you ain't gonna see any 12-foot gooks over here. SO KEEP YOUR FIRE LOW."
So much for Grossman's more sensitive view of the American G.I. in action.
So, moving right along: Soldiers in combat are frightened...they will kill anyone anytime so as to survive. And they do not spend a great deal of time agonizing over it afterwards. That is just nonsense. As for long term personal and societal effects: well, think for a moment of all the WWII, Vietnam, Korea, Gulf, Iraq, Afghanistan....veterans that you've ever known. Have you ever been taken hostage by one of them?
Vietnam: There was little practical difference between ground combat, or the American ground combatant, in Vietnam and any other American war in the tropical Pacific. Same climate, same terrain, same gooks. And that goes back to the Philippine Insurrection. Yes, the Army handled the rotation scheme badly, and yes, lots of soldiers found themselves back in civilian life only days after having been in combat, but Grossman cannot make a case that this caused any long-term psychological harm.
PTSD: This, I'm afraid, is largely speaking a fraud. Yes, the condition exists, but it is extremely rare difficult to diagnose, and no more prevalent from one war to another. The reason you hear so much about PTSD in connection with Vietnam Veterans is singular: someone told us the VA was handing out $ for bad experiences and some of us took it.
Now for the crux of the matter: The Army goes to no particular trouble to prepare soldiers for life-and-death struggle. It never has, I'm not sure why, but I think it's a good thing that it doesn't. Why? Well, what would they tell a guy? What COULD they tell him? NOTHING that would do any good, that's what.
And finally, Grossman, probably because he didn't think to ask, says nothing about the G.I. who ends up liking it. Every army, every theatre, every war produces a certain number of men who like the life - not the killing, because no one likes that, but the rest of it. I happened to me, I turned 19 and then 20 over there, and it happened to plenty of others. The reasons are various and complex, and that's another story.
Richard Vidaurri
Americal Division
The U.S. Army in Vietnam
197-1972
Author: The Gates of the Shadow
Quick shipping, great book
Rating:
I bought this book for my husband and he enjoyed it. We are both had the great opportunity to see Dave Grossman at a conference. He had your total attention at all times. What he had to say was Invaluable ....if you have the opportunity to see him, Do It !!!
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